Subject: EIA IBIS Open Forum Meeting Minutes (7/21/00)

From: [email-masked] (Guy de Burgh)
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 2000 09:19:56 -0700

Date: 7/25/00

SUBJECT: 7/21/00 EIA IBIS Open Forum Meeting Minutes

VOTING MEMBERS AND 2000 PARTICIPANTS LIST:
3Com                           Roy Leventhal*
Agilent (EEsof, etc.)          Mark Chang
Ansoft Corporation             (Eric Bracken)
Applied Simulation Technology  Raj Raghuram, Norio Matsui, Fred Balistreri*
Avanti                         Nikolai Bannov
Cadence Design                 Mike LaBonte*, Todd Westerhoff, Ian Dodd*,
                               Donald Telian, Patrick Dos Santos
Cisco Systems                  Syed Huq, Irfan Elahi, John Fisher
Compaq                         [Bob Haller], Peter LaFlamme, Ron Bellomio,
                               Shafier Rahman, Doug Burns
Cypress                        (Rajesh Manapat)
EMC Corporation                (Fabrizio Zanella),
Fairchild Semiconductor        Craig Klem
HyperLynx (& Pads Software)    Matthew Flora*, Kellee Crisafulli, Gene Garat,
                               John Angulo*, Al Davis, Lynne Green
IBM                            Michael Cohen*, Greg Edlund, Jerry Hayes
Innoveda (Viewlogic Systems)   Chris Rokusek, Guy de Burgh*, Jun Tian,
                               Cary Mandel, Brad Griffin, (Jon Powell)
Intel Corporation              Stephen Peters, Arpad Muranyi*, Will Hobbs,
                               Richard Mellitz, Charles Phares, Meir Nakar, 
                               Sigeti Gabi
LSI Logic                      (Larry Barnes)
Mentor Graphics (& Veribest)   Bob Ross*, Tom Dagostino, Malcolm Ash,
                               Kim Owen, Jean Oudinot, Sherif Hammad,
                               Hazam Hegazy, Weston Beal, Ken Bakalar
Mitsubishi                     Shahab Ahmed, Carleen Murphy
Molex Incorporated             Gus Panella
Motorola                       Ron Werner
National Semiconductor         Milt Schwartz
North East Systems Associates  Edward Sayre, Tony Sinker
Nortel Networks                Steve Coe, Calvin Trowell, Hassan Ali
Philips Semiconductor          D.C. Sessions, Todd Andersen
  (& VLSI Technology)
Quantic EMC                    (Mike Ventham)
Siemens AG                     Bernhard Unger, Gerald Bannert
SiQual                         Scott McMorrow, Wis Macomson
Texas Instruments              Stephen Nolan*, Ramzi Ammar, Mac McCaughey,
                               Thomas Fisher, Jean-Claude Perrin,
                               Jean-Yves Oberle
Time Domain Analysis Systems   Dima Smolyansky, Steven Corey
Tyco Electronics (AMP)         (Russell Moser)
Via Technologies               (Weber Chuang)
Zuken (& Incases)              Werner Rissiek, John Berrie

OTHER PARTICIPANTS IN 2000:
Actel Corp.                    Silvia Montoya
Advansis                       Mikio Kiyono
Aerospatiale Matra CCR         Lionel Dreux, Julien Boullie
Alcatel (Lannion, Bell)        Daniel Peron, Steven Criel
Brocade Communications         Robert Badal
ECI Telecom                    Daniel Adar
EIA                            Cecilia Fleming*
Fraunhofer Institute           Michael Kurten
Jet Propulsion Lab             John Treichlew
Hewlett Packard                Paul Gregory
Rockwell Collins               Ron Hau
Signals & Systems Engineering  Tom Hawkins
ST Micorelectronics            Fabrice Boissiere, Pierre Saintot
Sun Microsystems               Victor Chang
Thomson-CSF                    Savenrio Lerose, Pascal Vaslin, Thierry Zak,
                               Sylvie Lasserre
Transfer                       Hans Klos, Wilco Hamhuis
Xilinx, Inc.                   Susan Wu
Independent, Consultant        Hideki Fukuda

In the list above, attendees at the meeting are indicated by *. Principal
members or other active members who have not attended are in parentheses.
Participants who no longer are in the organization are in square brackets.

Upcoming Meetings:  The bridge numbers for future IBIS teleconferences are as
follows:

  Date                Bridge Number    Reservation #    Passcode
  August 11, 2000     (916) 356-9200   6-234930         7474775
  August 25, 2000     (916) 356-9200   4-347958         9918979
  September 14, 2000  IBIS Summit Meeting - No Teleconference

All meetings are 8:00 AM to 9:55 AM Pacific Time.  We try to have agendas out
7 days before each Open Forum and meeting minutes out within 7 days after.
When you call into the meeting, ask for the IBIS Open Forum hosted by Will
Hobbs and give the reservation number and passcode.

NOTE: "AR" = Action Required.

-------------------------------- MINUTES -------------------------------------

INTRODUCTIONS AND MEETING QUORUM
No new participants.  Bob Ross thanked Guy de Burgh for conducting the last
meeting and handling general IBIS business.

MEMBERSHIP UPDATE AND TREASURER'S REPORT
Cecilia Fleming reported receiving the purchase order from Ansoft Corporation
for EIA IBIS Open Forum membership.  So Ansoft Corporation is now listed as a
voting member.

Guy de Burgh reported that he has generated an updated IBIS roster, but is
still checking on some comments.  Bob Ross commented that a few of the
members that are on his list have been deleted this year since they have not
paid.  Bob will work with Cecilia off-line regarding some membership payments.

REVIEW OF MINUTES AND AR'S
The June 30, 2000 IBIS Minutes were approved.

The AR's will be discussed during the meeting.

MISCELLANY/ANNOUNCEMENTS
Bob Ross had two course announcements:

Raj Raghuram will be teaching a weekend course at San Jose State University
on "Electrical Requirements of Microelectronic Packaging" starting
September 2, 2000 and will cover IBIS if time permits.

For further information contact Prof. Guna Selvaduray at SJSU:
PH: (408) 924-3874
FAX:(408) 924-4057
email: [email-masked]

Arpad Muranyi will teach a two-day short course as part of the "Circuit
Simulation and Signal Integrity in Microelectronic Circuits and Systems"  as
part of the 3-day short course sponsored by the University of Arizona and
conducted in Phoenix, Arizona.  Arpad will teach "Introduction to IBIS Models"
and "IBIS Modeling Hands-on Experience".  This course will be conducted in 
September 11-12, 2000.

PRESS AND WEB PAGE UPDATES
No reports other than routine web page updates.

NEW MODELS AVAILABLE, LIBRARY UPDATE
Mike LaBonte has provided an Update to the IBIS Model Library in the official
IBIS Home page Models link.  Mike will be adding some more models.  He
commented on the amount of work necessary to check out the links and also
on the fact that links may change (and become busted) very quickly.  Also,
Mike is investigating the possibility of third party web sites that would
support automatically locating models using their search engines.

Mike will send a notice to the reflector for corrections and for information
on more links.

OPENS FOR NEW ISSUES
None.

INTERNATIONAL/EXTERNAL PROGRESS
- IEC 62014-1 (IBIS Version 3.2) - Bob Ross may still need the document to 
help draft some header information.

- pr EIAJ ED-5302 Standard for I/O Interface Model for Integrated Circuits
(IMIC) - No report.

- IEC PWI 93-1 Models of Integrated Circuits for EMI Behavioral Simulation
(formerly designated as IEC 93/67/NP IBIS and EMC Simulation) - Ian Dodd
asked if there is a Web Site.  Bob Ross responded that he is waiting for some
updated information that he can upload or distribute.  The official 
information is contained in various European IBIS Summit presentations.  The
latest presentations are uploaded in March 2000.

- JEDEC JC-16 - No Report.

PCB EAST 2000 IBIS SUMMIT MEETING PLANNING
Bob Ross discussed the pending IBIS Summit Meeting scheduled on Thursday,
September 14, 2000 in Worcester, Massachusetts and held along with the
PCB East Conference 2000.  The IBIS meeting will be at the Crowne Plaza hotel,
a few blocks from the PCB East Conference.  So far, Cadence and NESA are
co-sponsors.  Bob still needs to get in touch with Kathy Breda and get other
sponsors.  (Guy de Burgh had sent out a sponsorship request earlier on the
IBIS reflector.)

Bob indicated that some preliminary information will be sent out at the end
of July, about six weeks before the meeting.  The expected agenda should
include Connector Model Specification, IBIS futures and IBIS accuracy and
experiences.  Later, the following presentation is expected:

  Roy Leventhal, 3com, - "IBIS and SI at 3com"
    (Presented by Mike LaBonte, Cadence)

DESIGNCON 2001 IBIS SUMMIT MEETING PLANNING
Bob Ross discussed the planning done to date on the IBIS Summit Meeting held
with DesignCon 2001 in San Jose, California.  DesignCon 2001 is scheduled from
January 29, 2001 to February 1, 2001.  The IBIS Summit Meeting is currently
scheduled on Monday, January 29, 2001.

This was discussed at the last meeting.  Bob commented in response to one
issue that we are again planning to hold the meeting in one of the larger
rooms.

As before, we are planning to be an Associate Sponsor of DesignCon 2001.  This
year, we need to confirm this since we will be mentioned in the literature.
One difference is that the literature will give signup information.  We need
to decide on this.  Bob will ask National Semiconductor if they will do this
again.  [Added note, National will do the signup.]  Otherwise, Guy de Burgh
will be listed for Summit Meeting signup.

Bob will also ask if National is interested again in being a co-sponsor and
supplying lunch.

Bob discussed having a passive booth this year.  In the past we have had
electrical demonstrations.  However, the individuals involved may not be
available this year.  Guy de Burgh stated that Innoveda would be able to
supply the backdrop again, and Jon Powell has velcro backed logos of member
companies.  Bob mentioned that he has EIA literature to hand out.  So we
should have some material.  As before the booth provides a neutral meeting
place for IBIS folks to meet without disturbing presentations at vendor
booths.

We agreed to go forward with these plans.

IBIS MODEL REVIEW COMMITTEE DISCUSSION
Matthew Flora reported that no new models have been received.  We discussed
some of the model review aspects.  This was also discussed at the last
meeting.  Several individuals submitted documents on the IBIS reflector on
validating models.

Bob Ross mentioned that he also spends about one to four hours reviewing
models and providing comments.  Also the reviewers are intended to be from
EDA vendors since part of the process is to test the models in various EDA
tools.

Mike LaBonte suggested that it might be helpful to have more test waveforms
supplied for correlation.  He currently does comparisons with the table
waveforms that are inside the IBIS model.

CONNECTOR PROPOSAL REVIEW (CONTINUED)
Bob Ross commented that the Connector Working Group is continuing to meet
regularly.  The last meeting was on July 18, 2000.  The subject was to
continue on clarify the Swath approach.  The goal is to agree within the
Working Group and revise the document accordingly. Then it will release the
document to the IBIS Open Forum for full committee review.

Bob needs to document a possible algorithm for expanding the Swath into a
larger Swath or full connector model.  Gus Panella had supplied several
2 by X connector model examples as the basis of the discussion.

IBIS FUTURES (IBIS-X, API, BIRDxx)
Mike LaBonte reported that the last teleconference was on July 11, 2000.  Al
Davis had a number of files containing proposals, and the Working Group is
sifting through this data.  The committee has reached some general agreement
regarding some circuit elements.  John Angulo is responsible for generating
a template for the proposed format.

The next meeting is scheduled for Tuesday, July 25, 2000.  Michael Cohen
indicated that he wanted to become involved.

Stephen Nolan's proposal regarding an HTML version of IBIS will be discussed.

Michael Cohen asked if there has been any consideration regarding an HDL 
version.  Mike stated that so far they are waiting for someone (Michael) to
look into it. 

Bob Ross commented on IBIS 4.X plans in response to a question raised at the
last meeting.  Bob stated that IBIS 4.X would be an upgrade to IBIS 3.2 that
would include:

  BIRD62.6 for receiver thresholds
  Other pending BIRDs that are approved (probably the C_comp BIRD65)
  Possibly some agreement regarding BIRD61.
  An addition for SSO per proposals made by Dr. Bernhard Unger at various
    IBIS Summit Meetings.

The next meeting is scheduled for Tuesday, July 25, 2000.  Michael Cohen
indicated that he wanted to become involved.

IBISCHK3 BUG TRACKING
- BUG34 - No Error Reported for Missing V/I Tables in Output Buffers
  Matthew Flora had issued revised text to simplify the Error messages.  Bob
  Ross regarded the revisions as acceptable.  The group approved the action
  modify ibischk3 per BUG34.

- BUG41 - Issue Warning Instead of Error for Common Differential Pin
  Bob Ross indicated that the changes of BUG41 will be implemented per the
  actions of the last meeting.

- BUG42 - Warning Message for Outputs with Thresholds Needed
  Per the discussion at the previous meeting, Matthew Flora still intends to
  propose revised wording for the Warning message.  We reviewed some of the
  previous discussion including the extent to which the test could be
  conducted.

  AR - Matthew Flora propose revised wording for the BUG42 Warning message.

- BUG43 - Error for Zero or Negative dV/dt Ramp Data Needed
  Bob Ross mentioned that BUG43 was discussed, but not classified at the
  last meeting.  After some discussion, we decided that this should be an
  Moderate, Medium, Open.

  Also, after some discussion following from the last meeting, we decided that
  this message should be a Warning message (versus and Error message).  Bob
  wanted the most simple test and did not want it to consider combinations
  of keywords (e.g., whether or not [Driver Schedule] was invoked, whether
  or not [Rising Waveform] and [Falling Waveform] tables were used, etc.).
  For some cases, the problem may not be important in some (but not all) EDA
  simulators.  In other cases, the bad data will cause the simulation to
  fail in most simulators.  Therefore, this is an important Warning to review.

- BUG44 - Warning for Parasitic Resistance Set Too High at 1000 Ohms
  Bob Ross reviewed the discussion of the previous Meeting.  BUG44 had been
  classified, but the new resistance value had not been set.  After some more
  discussion, the group decided on 50 ohms.

- BUG45 - GND* and POWER* Nets Generate Errors in EBD Files
  Michael Cohen introduced BUG45 which had been recently submitted.  An Error
  message is issued with net names starting with GND and POWER in EBD files.
  IBIS allows net names to have more characters.  Since the ibischk3 parser
  incorrectly issues Error messages for correct files, this was classified as
  Moderate, High, Open.  We plan to submit BUG45 to be fixed.

Bob Ross commented that Mike LaBonte had sent out on the IBIS reflector some
comments on ibischk3.  Included was a comment that 80 character lines that
pass in Unix may fail when translated into DOS format - creating a lot of
Error messages.  Mike plans to issue a BUG report on this problem.

Bob commented that he will find our the status of the Bug fixes from Atul
Agarwal.  Michael Cohen indicated that he would like to have an updated
parser soon.

BIRD61.1 - ENHANCED CHARACTERIZATION OF RECEIVERS
Not Discussed.

BIRD64.1 - PACKAGE MODE SELECTOR
Michael Cohen mentioned that he wants this discussed at the next meeting.

BIRD65 - C_comp REFINEMENTS
Arpad Muranyi reported that he will issue an updated BIRD65.1.  Bob Ross wants
to discuss this at the next meeting.

BIRD66 - [Model Spec] Vref ADDITION
Not discussed.

NEXT MEETING:
The next teleconference meeting will be on Friday, August 11, 2000 from
8:00 AM to 10:00 AM.
==============================================================================
                                      NOTES

IBIS CHAIR: Bob Ross (503) 685-0732, Fax (503) 685-4897
            [email-masked]
            Modeling Engineer, Mentor Graphics
            8005 S.W. Boeckman Road, Wilsonville, OR 97070

VICE CHAIR: Stephen Peters (503) 264-4108, Fax: (503) 264-4515
            [email-masked]
            Senior Hardware Engineer, Intel Corporation
            M/S JF1-209
            2111 NE 25th Ave.
            Hillsboro, OR 97124-5961

SECRETARY:  Guy de Burgh (805) 988-8250, Fax: (805) 988-8259
            [email-masked]
            Senior Manager, Innoveda
            1369 Del Norte Rd.
            Camarillo, CA 93010-8437

LIBRARIAN:  Mike LaBonte (978) 262-6496, Fax: (978) 446-6798
            [email-masked]
            Senior Technologist, Cadence Design Systems
            270 Billerica Road
            Chelmsford, MA 01824

WEBMASTER:  Syed Huq (408) 525-3399, Fax: (408) 526-5504
            [email-masked]
            Manager, Hardware Engineering, Cisco Systems
            170 West Tasman Drive
            San Jose, CA 95134-1706

POSTMASTER: John Angulo (425) 869-2320, Fax: (425) 881-1008
            [email-masked]
            Development Engineer, HyperLynx, Inc.
            14715 N.E. 95th Street, Suite 200
            Redmond, WA 98052

This meeting was conducted in accordance with the EIA Legal Guides and EIA
Manual of Organization and Procedure.

The following e-mail addresses are used:

  [email-masked]
      To join, change, or drop from either the IBIS Open Forum Reflector
      ([email-masked]), the IBIS Users' Group Reflector ([email-masked])
      or both.  State your request.

  [email-masked]
      To obtain general information about IBIS, to ask specific questions
      for individual response, and to inquire about joining the EIA-IBIS
      Open Forum as a full Member.

  [email-masked]
      To send a message to the general IBIS Open Forum Reflector.  This
      is used mostly for IBIS Standardization business and future IBIS
      technical enhancements.  Job posting information is not permitted.

  [email-masked]
      To send a message to the IBIS Users' Group Reflector.  This is
      used mostly for IBIS clarification, current modeling issues, and
      general user concerns.  Job posting information is not permitted.

  [email-masked]
      To report ibischk2/3 parser bugs.  The Bug Report Form Resides on
      eda.org in /pub/ibis/bugs/ibischk/bugform.txt along with reported bugs.

      To report s2ibis, s2ibis2 and s2iplt bugs, use the Bug Report Forms
      which reside under eda.org in /pub/ibis/bugs/s2ibis/bugs2i.txt,
      /pub/ibis/bugs/s2ibis2/bugs2i2.txt, & /pub/ibis/bugs/s2iplt/bugsplt.txt
      respectively.

Information on IBIS technical contents, IBIS participants, and actual
IBIS models are available on the IBIS Home page found by selecting the
Electronic Information Group under:

  http://www.eia.org/eig/ibis/ibis.htm

Check the pub/ibis directory on eda.org for more information on previous
discussions and results.  You can get on via FTP anonymous.
==============================================================================