SV-BC Meeting Date: Monday, September 17, 2007 Time: 09:00am-11:00am PDT 102020213131010001020211 Day 760639510406295588439514 000000000000000001111000 Month 998877665544433212200998 000000000000000000000000 Year 777777777777777776666666 aaa-aaaaaaaaaaaa---aaaaa Matt Maidment - Intel aaaaaaaaaaaaa-aaaaaaaaaa Brad Pierce - Synopsys aaaaaaaaaaaa-aaaaaaaaaaa Shalom Bresticker - Intel -a--aaaa-aaa-aaaaaa-aaaa Cliff Cummings - Sunburst Design a----aaa--a-aaaaaaaaaaa- Surrendra Dudani - Synopsys aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa Mark Hartoog - Synopsys aaaaaaaa-a-a-aaaaa-a-aaa Francoise Martinolle - Cadence aaaaaa-a-aaaaa-aaaaaaaaa Karen Pieper - Synopsys aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa-aaaaaaa Dave Rich - Mentor Graphics a-aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa-aaaa Steven Sharp - Cadence aaaaa-aaaa-aa-a-aaaaaaaa Gordon Vreugdenhil - Mentor Graphics aaa-a-aaaaaa-aa-a--aaaaa Stu Sutherland - Sutherland HDL aaaaaaaaa-aaaaa--------- Alex Gran - Mentor Graphics aaaa--aaaaaa-aa-a-aaaaa- Don Mills - LCDM Engineering aaa-aaaaa-aaaaaaaaa-aaaa Heath Chambers - Consultant/Trainer --a-aaa----------------- Will Cummings - Synplicity aaaa-------------------- Tom Alsop - Intel ---------------aa---aa-a Doug Warmke - Mentor Graphics a----------------------- Greg Jaxon - Synopsys Agenda + Review IEEE patent policy http://standards.ieee.org/board/pat/pat-slideset.ppt Reviewed. + Review Minutes of Previous Meetings http://www.eda-stds.org/sv-bc/minutes/sv-bc_07_09_06.txt Heath moves to approve minutes as posted. Gord seconds. No opposed. No abstain. Motion passes. + Name resolution F2F Mentor will host in Bay Area. Gord will send address and directions to sv-bc and sv-ec reflectors + Issues Review results of e-mail ballot. Pass: 933, 1302, 1417, 1554, 1767 1175 (http://www.eda.org/svdb/view.php?id=1175) Karen moves to accept with amendment: "width no leading spaces" --> "with no leading spaces" Steve seconds. No opposed. No abstain. Motion passes. 1302 (http://www.eda.org/svdb/view.php?id=1302) Issue passed by email vote. AI: Shalom open SVDB item based on his feedback to SVDB 1302: http://www.eda.org/sv-bc/hm/6745.html 1354 (http://www.eda.org/svdb/view.php?id=1354) Shalom moves to accept proposal. Brad seconds. Opposed: Dave (text would be better positioned in 3.11) Abstain: Gord (better to have some improvement than no improvement) Motion passes. 1438 (http://www.eda.org/svdb/view.php?id=1438) Based on feedback, move out of immediate priority. 1468 (http://www.eda.org/svdb/view.php?id=1468) Brad moved out of immediate. Tom will add new proposal, 1473 (http://www.eda.org/svdb/view.php?id=1473) Dave: 1step is a new keyword Steve: 1step is not a keyword, it's special syntactic combination Brad: step is not a keyword Gord: Not sure proposal covers everything but better than current state. Brad moves to accept proposal. Steven seconds. No opposed. No abstain. Motion passes. 1554 (http://www.eda.org/svdb/view.php?id=1554) Shalom moves to accept proposal with friendly amendment: "any dimension expressions, if present, are constant expressions". Brad seconds. No opposed. No abstain. Motion passes. AI: Brad to update proposal for SVDB 1554. Other immediate priority items 1989 (http://www.eda.org/svdb/view.php?id=1989) Francoise: Should we ask SV-CC to review VPI text for use of literal and string. Francoise to create mantis item. Encryption section also needs to be reviewed. Dave moves to accept the revised proposal. Shalom seconds. No opposed. No abstain. Motion passes. 1937 (http://www.eda.org/svdb/view.php?id=1937) This sentence: "A port can be a declaration of an interface, an event, or a variable or net of any allowed data type, including an array, a structure, or a union." brings to light a potential problem with how interfaces are described. In this context it's a reference to an interface. This sentence is just moved as a part of this proposal. It is suggested that a new SVDB item be opened to address wording surrounding interface ports. Shalom moves to accept proposal. Brad seconds. No opposed. No abstain. Motion passes. AI: Open SVDB item to review wording regarding interfaces such as "A port can be a declaration of an interface" 1863 (http://www.eda.org/svdb/view.php?id=1863) Shalom reworded to accommodate calling as task or function. Making quoted argument optional, then can accommodate NULL arg to system function. This behavior needs to be specified: "If called with no string, system function will be called with NULL string". Need to describe return data type when called as a function. int is correct type. Use $cast as an example. AI: Shalom to update proposal for SVDB 1863 902 (http://www.eda.org/svdb/view.php?id=902) Proposal addresses basic mechanics for enabling module/gate instantiations in interfaces. General agreement that this should be allowable but it needs to be better understood. Some questions about adding this into the language: How to handle hierarchical references through modports How to reference data types in generated scopes in interfaces 907 (http://www.eda.org/svdb/view.php?id=907) This doesn't make the language worse. Restricting default type parameter value to ensure semantic correctness for module compilation will break current designs, so this direction is unlikely. This makes clear a practice that users are currently doing by specifying 'int' as the default data type to placate the compiler. If one such module is not instantiated, it is an error. This forces large design methodologies to introduce libraries of these modules using -y switch only. Would benefit stating that modules using this feature that are not explicitly instantiated are not implicitly instantiated as top-level modules. This should be restricted to ANSI-style declarations only. AI: Brad to update proposal for 907 based on feedback during Sep 17 meeting. AI: Matt send email ballot on Friday, September 21. Next meeting October 1, 2007. 10:59am Gord moves to adjourn. Action Items Completed 08/20/2007 Brad to open mantis item to clarify empty argument characterization at beginning or end of an argument list: (, or ,) (SVDB 2006) 09/06/2007 Matt send another e-mail ballot with up to 10 issues. 09/06/2007 Brad to update proposal for SVDB 1939 with friendly amendment 09/06/2007 Matt send to Neil capturing committee status (name-resolution, queue operations and general issue resolution but no other major blocking items to freeze date). 08/20/2007 Matt ask Neil whether 348 is addressed and can be closed or should remain open. SV-BC not in favor of pursuing deprecation at this time. 08/20/2007 Shalom to update proposal for 1937 with friendly amendments 09/06/2007 Shalom file issue regarding differences in section 20.6 between 1800-2008 Draft 3 and 1364-2005. (SVDB 2032) 09/06/2007 Shalom to file SVDB item regarding column headings of Table 25-18 (SVDB 2024) 09/06/2007 Dave update proposal for SVDB 1989 striking edits to 20.6 Pending 01/09/2006 Shalom file new issure related to SVDB 1254 and include example 03/27/2006 Cliff post examples demonstrating the need for 0-1 wildcard to justify further action on SVDB 99 Other ideas: elsex, defaultx, ifx, alwaysx, initialx, Question: what about X expression in index of Vector or array expressions (a[i] where i === 'X). Cliff to pursue further action. 04/10/2006 Steven to create proposal for SVDB 1386 04/10/2006 Steven to create proposal for SVDB 1078 06/19/2006 Francoise check with SV-CC regariding suitability of data read API to address debugging of "dynamic data" in lieu of vcd extensions. 07/10/2006 Steve add bugnote to 1043 about specifics for resolution 07/31/2006 Steve add bug note to 1481 with details for a clearer proposal 09/25/2006 Matt add SVDB entry to request capability to packages: import/export & non-exported (local) package declarations. 10/09/2006 Brad: enhance 1554 proposal to prevent circularity of expressions (address use or non-use of hierarchical references). 10/23/2006 Matt send example of use of forward typedef. 12/04/2006 Shalom present compelling example of `begin_define -- `end_define 12/18/2006 Cliff open Mantis item about 'predefault' with compelling examples 01/08/2007 Vendors to describe interpretation of a path when there are multiple drivers involved and share test cases on reflector. 03/05/2007 ALL look at SV-AC items and send Matt a note if you require more information to address them. Matt will work with SV-AC to get additional information. 03/19/2007 Cliff send e-mail to Karen regarding SVDB account 04/26/2007 All: Revisit concept of memory in Draft 3 Affects PLI backward compatibility and readmem system tasks. After some discussion, ambivalence gave way to agreement that arrays and memories as covered in 7.4 need to be revisited for clarification. SVDB 1362 covers this issue. Dave will start working on it. 06/11/2007 Stu reword proposal for SVDB 1111 06/11/2007 Matt notify SV-AC to update 1641 to system task/function section 06/11/2007 Mark attempt to define 'variation' in context of resolving SVDB 1850 06/25/2007 Gord add new SVDB entry and proposal to address expression sizing issues for literals of unspecified widths. 06/25/2007 Steve look into ability to use 1800 types with old-style port decls 08/06/2007 Steven to record concerns about issues related to issue 1935. 08/06/2007 Dave to review string in merged document to see where it ought to be string literal or string datatype. Prompted by discussion of 331 but review is to be of entire merged document. 09/06/2007 Stu to write proposal for SVDB 1826 09/06/2007 Shalom to rewrite proposal for SVDB 1988 based on committee vote during September 6 meeting. 09/17/2007 Shalom open SVDB item based on his feedback to SVDB 1302: http://www.eda.org/sv-bc/hm/6745.html 09/17/2007 Brad to update proposal for SVDB 1554. 09/17/2007 Shalom to update proposal for SVDB 1863