SV-BC Meeting Date: Monday, January 17, 2011 Time: 9:00am-11:00am PST Toll Free Dial In Number in North America: 1-888-813-5316 Caller Paid Dial In Number: 1-650-584-6338 Meeting ID: 7839818 10202213101 Day 76285730629 01111000000 Month 12110998887 11111111111 Year 10000000000 aaaaaaaaa-a Matt Maidment - Intel aaaaaaa-aaa Brad Pierce - Synopsys aaaaaaaaaaa Mark Hartoog - Synopsys aaaaaaaa-aa Dave Rich - Mentor Graphics aa-aaaaaaaa Gordon Vreugdenhil - Mentor Graphics -aaaaa-aa-a Alex Gran - Mentor Graphics -aaa--a--aa Heath Chambers - Consultant/Trainer aaaaaaaaa-a Tom Alsop - Intel ------aaaaa Cliff Cummings - Sunburst Design aaaaaaaaaaa Shalom Bresticker - Intel aa-aa---aaa Don Mills - LCDM Engineering aaa-aaaaaaa Arnab Saha - Mentor Graphics a---a-aa-aa Daniel Schostak - ARM aaaaaaa--aa Kaiming Ho - Fraunhofer Institute -a-a-aaaaa- Steven Sharp - Cadence aaaaa-aaaaa Francoise Martinolle - Cadence aa-aa-aa-aa Eric Coffin - Mentor Graphics -a--------- David Gates - AMD aa-a-aaa--a Peter Flake - Elda Technology ----------- Scott Little - Freescale ----------- John Havlicek - Freescale ----------- Rishiyur Nikhil - BlueSpec ------a---a Jonathan Bromley - Verilab a--------a- Greg Jaxon - Synopsys a-aaaaa---- Linc Jepson - 74ze Agenda + Review IEEE patent policy http://standards.ieee.org/board/pat/pat-slideset.ppt Gord moves to consider it read. Mark seconds. No opposed. No abstain. Motion passes. + Previous Meeting Minutes http://www.eda.org/sv-bc/minutes/sv-bc_10_12_06.txt Gord moves to accept the minutes. Dave seconds. No opposed. No abstain. Motion passes. + SV-BC Chair/Co-Chair Vote Don moves to Matt Maidment as chair and Brad Pierce as co-chair. Gord seconds. No opposed. No abstain. Motion passes. + Participant Update Matt reiterated Neil's announcement regarding no change in rules for participation. http://www.eda.org/sv-bc/hm/10789.html + Interface Discussion Consensus to-date includes: Support for parameterized interfaces No support for run-time compatibility checking Prevailing opinion is to not unify classes and interfaces A couple of informal meetings were held over the past few weeks. Brad posted a summary of the progress on the reflector: http://www.eda.org/sv-bc/hm/10769.html and follow-on discussion ensued. Plan to re-sync and identify next steps. Steven Sharp pointed out that using sub-interfaces reduces maintenance of virtual interfaces. Sub-interface can limit parameter maintenance for testbench to only those that are relevant for that portion of the testbench. This is a methodological solution to the issue of maintaining links between testbench and design. Jonathan Bromley agreed to create examples. This does not address difficult questions about virtual interfaces. Mark would like to see issue of interface instance binding resolved. Configurations enable users to specify which version of a module to use for an instance. Cannot do that with virtual interfaces or interface ports. Virtual interface type can change during simulation. Users want packages that refer to interface types that are never defined in the design. This means implementations need to do run-time checking for symbols. By providing some syntax to couple pure interface type and packages with actual, elaborated type, then can reliably resolve instances. If users refuse to use feature, resolution left to support of vendors, as is done today. How to associate data type with interfaces also needs to be done. Using extern interfaces in a package is a smaller change, but will limit visibility into interfaces and is likely not the best solution. Extern interface already defined and not quite the right fit. A pure interface type would provide flexibility of definition in compilation unit, module or other scopes. This does not reduce the effectiveness of the sub-interface methodology. Brad asked which languages have addresses the identifier resolution issues. Gord offered C++ for static resolution and Ruby for dynamic resolution. VHDL has addressed some of these issues, too. Mark suggests can also define how virtual interfaces are bound. Might be more backward-compatible. Gord concerned that this is tractable. There were issues raised about libraries, how package names are managed and resolved and many more issues with design resolution. AI: Gord provide some details on pure interfaces AI: Peter explore modports as linkage AI: Mark explore defining missing resolution semantics Follow-up on Issue 210 Still looking for details to justify any language enhancement. Mantis 2889 [http://www.eda.org/svdb/view.php?id=2889] Shalom posted an updated proposal to the reflector: http://www.eda.org/sv-bc/hm/10735.html AI: Matt open email vote on updated proposal for 2889. Progress/Discussion for Top 10 Looking for proposal sketches or discussion for any of these issues. 696 - Complete 2310(1084, 1201) - Participants: Eric, Tom, Shalom, Steven, Wilson Snyder 3053 - Participants: Francoise, Mark, Alex, Kaiming 3055 - Participants: Gord, Mark 2991 - Champion: Tom, Participants: Steven 1566 - For future discussion 2114 - Similar to 3053. Have same group look at it. 210 - Participants: Shalom, Matt 3056 - Champion: Shalom, Participants: Steven, Francoise 2310 - Eric working on some reference implementation to faciliate discussion. He's about 1/2 done. 10:52: Meeting adjourned Action Items Complete Outstanding 05/10/10 Matt create Master Issue for WG-approved SV-BC Top-25 07/19/10 Matt follow-up about voting rules for technical sub-committee. Is there a limit on the number of reps from 1 entity? 07/19/10 Dave to post request to reflectors for clarification of 2108 07/19/10 Jonathan post some items for discussion related to 2114 to reflector. 08/02/10 Brad give SV-BC feedback on Mantis 2992 to Mehdi 08/02/10 Eric start reflector thread on Mantis 2310 08/02/10 Gord meet F2F with Mark when in Bay Area 08/16/10 Matt to rethink 210 in terms of configuration and alias. 08/16/20 All send Shalom feedback about prioritizing the issues raised in port declaration issue summary: http://www.eda.org/sv-bc/hm/10498.html 09/13/10 Jonathan show simple examples of virtual interfaces, sub-interfaces and base classes in modules to demonstrate different methods for connecting design and testbenches. 09/27/10 Tom post updated proposal to 696. 09/27/10 Review Shalom's list of interface issues and suggest issues to tackle now. 05/10/10 Matt create Master Issue for WG-approved SV-BC Top-25 07/19/10 Matt follow-up about voting rules for technical sub-committee. Is there a limit on the number of reps from 1 entity? 07/19/10 Dave to post request to reflectors for clarification of 2108 07/19/10 Jonathan post some items for discussion related to 2114 to reflector. 08/02/10 Brad give SV-BC feedback on Mantis 2992 to Mehdi 08/02/10 Eric start reflector thread on Mantis 2310 08/02/10 Gord meet F2F with Mark when in Bay Area 08/16/10 Matt to rethink 210 in terms of configuration and alias. 08/16/20 All send Shalom feedback about prioritizing the issues raised in port declaration issue summary: http://www.eda.org/sv-bc/hm/10498.html 09/13/10 Jonathan show simple examples of virtual interfaces, sub-interfaces and base classes in modules to demonstrate different methods for connecting design and testbenches. 09/27/10 Tom post updated proposal to 696. 09/27/10 Review Shalom's list of interface issues and suggest issues to tackle now. 11/22/10 Brad to file Mantis item for upward passing of interfaces. 12/06/10 Matt open new Mantis item covering determination of port kind for .named_port connection (23.2.2.3). 01/17/11 Matt open email vote for 2889 01/17/11 Gord sketch solution for pure interfaces for Jan 31, 2011 meeting 01/17/11 Peter sketch solution for using modports to address resolution of virtual interfaces for Jan 31, 2011 meeting. 01/17/11 Mark sketch solution for defining virtual interface resolution semantics for Jan 31, 2011 meeting.