SV-BC Meeting Date: Monday, September 12, 2011 Time: 9:00am-11:00am PDT Toll Free Dial In Number in North America: 1-888-813-5316 Caller Paid Dial In Number: 1-650-584-6338 Meeting ID: 45961 12101202021211310202213101 Day 29518063951844176285730629 00000000000000001111000000 Month 98887665544332112110998887 11111111111111111111111111 Year 11111111111111110000000000 aaaaaaaaaaaa-aa-a-a-aaaaa- Steven Sharp - Cadence -aaaaaaa--aaaa-aaaaa-aaaaa Francoise Martinolle - Cadence aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa-a Matt Maidment - Intel a--a-a-aa-aaa-aaaaaaaaaa-a Tom Alsop - Intel -aaa-aaaa-aaaa-aaaaaaaaaaa Shalom Bresticker - Intel aaaaaaaaa-aaaaaaaaaaaaa-aa Dave Rich - Mentor Graphics -aaaa-a-aaaaaaaaa-aaaaaaaa Gordon Vreugdenhil - Mentor Graphics aaa-aaaaaaaa-aa-aaaaa-aa-a Alex Gran - Mentor Graphics ---a--aaaaaaaaaaaa-aaaaaaa Arnab Saha - Mentor Graphics aaa-aa-aa-a-a-aaa-aa-aa-aa Eric Coffin - Mentor Graphics aa-aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa-aaa Brad Pierce - Synopsys aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa Mark Hartoog - Synopsys -aaaa-aaa----aaaa-a-aaa--a Peter Flake - Accellera Rep aaaa-aaaa----a-a---a-aa-aa Daniel Schostak - ARM ---aa-aaa--a-aaaaaaaaa--aa Kaiming Ho - Fraunhofer Institute (Observer) aaaaa---a----------------- Stu Sutherland - IEEE 1800 Editor (Observer) ---------------a--------a- Greg Jaxon - Synopsys -------------------------- Scott Little - Freescale -------------------------- John Havlicek - Freescale -------------aa------aaaaa Cliff Cummings - Sunburst Design -------------aa-aaa--a--aa Heath Chambers - Consultant/Trainer -------------aaaa-aa---aaa Don Mills - LCDM Engineering -------------aa-a--------- David Gates - AMD --------------aa-aaaaa---- Linc Jepson - 74ze -------------------------- Rishiyur Nikhil - BlueSpec ---------------------a---a Jonathan Bromley - Verilab Agenda + Review IEEE patent policy http://standards.ieee.org/board/pat/pat-slideset.ppt Brad moves to consider patent policy reviewed. Eric seconds. No opposed. No abstain. + Review previous meeting minutes http://www.eda.org/sv-bc/minutes/sv-bc_11_08_29.txt Dave moves to approve the minutes. Eric seconds. No opposed. No abstain Motion passes. + Countdown to October 1, 2011 Committee work is to complete by October 1. Matt suggests completing 1523, 2081 and Shalom's port issues by the deadline and hold an extra meeting if needed to do so. No one voiced support for an extra meeting. + Review Status of Mature Issues 1523 - http://www.eda.org/svdb/view.php?id=1523 Steven suggested that handling of width of integral first and second expressions be described by reference to other sections. Dave will update accordingly. Handling of reals should be included as already described. Dave updated the proposal one more time regarding width of integral first and second expressions and handling of reals and uploaded a new proposal. Stu pointed that a dash should proceed the sentence starting with "For aggregate.." Dave moves to accept updated proposal for 1523. With friendly amendment raised by Stu. Steven seconds. No opposed. No abstain. Motion passes. AI: Dave update proposal for 1523 per friendly amendment. 2081 - http://www.eda.org/svdb/view.php?id=2081 Steven sent proposal and Gord sent feedback. Steven updated accordingly. Consensus is that this statement is clarifying defined functionality: "Expressions appearing as arguments of subroutine calls are analyzed appropriately for their direction, regardless of whether the subroutine contents are analyzed." and should be moved to a note. Consensus is that the following statement: "Calls to void functions are analyzed as normal functions." should be further clarified that it applies to non-time-consuming tasks that are eligible to be coded as void functions if one wishes for contents to be analyzed for process sensitivity. It was raised the statement referring to class objects/methods should change to something like: References to class objects and method calls of class objects do not add anything to the sensitivity list of an always_comb, except for contributions by arguments of the method calls. Issue with this is that it conflicts with intent to clarify that static method functions can be confusingly included here. Dave moves to accept proposal. Steven seconds. No opposed. No abstain. Motion passes. 1251 - http://www.eda.org/svdb/view.php?id=1251 Brad updated proposal per his AI. + Feedback for SV-AC Regarding Mantis 3069 http://www.eda.org/svdb/view.php?id=3069 Per this post to the reflector: http://www.eda.org/sv-bc/hm/11202.html The SV-BC discussed this issue. Suggestion is to either accept the consequences of the change or define a new feature, e.g. local clocking, as well as the interaction between the two features. SV-BC members have been notified and can alert others as they feel needed. The SV-BC suggests raising this with 1800 if the SV-AC feels there is a need to get official feedback from member companies. Steven moves that Matt send the above feedback to the reflector. Brad seconds. No opposed. No abstain. Motion passes. + Feedback regarding Port Issues See Shalom's reflector post: http://www.eda.org/sv-bc/hm/11176.html No one has reviewed this proposal. Some sentiment was expressed that this work is useful. There was consensus that no additional meeting be scheduled to address the issue. It can be discussed at the next meeting as there are no other issues with proposals. 11:59AM: Steven moves to adjourn. + 3073 - http://www.eda.org/svdb/view.php?id=3073 Per the last meeting there is a desire to identify a list of issues with $bits, e.g.: - $bits of some data types are not well defined (e.g. class handle) - What makes a $bits call constant? - What makes a $bits call non-constant? Please send additional issues to the reflector, file in Mantis or come prepared for discussion. Top 25 Mantis Items 696 - Complete 2310(1084, 1201) - Participants: Eric, Tom, Shalom, Steven, Wilson Snyder 3053 - Participants: Francoise, Mark, Alex, Kaiming 3055 - Participants: Gord, Mark 2991 - Champion: Tom, Participants: Steven 1566 - For future discussion 2114 - Similar to 3053. Have same group look at it. 210 - Complete 3056 - Champion: Shalom, Participants: Steven, Francoise 1084 - Logical Expressions in Macros 2115 - X-Optimism/X-Pessimism resolution 3073 - Collected $bits issues 1697 - Macro Loops 1202 - Define Standard Preprocessor 1251 - Resolved 2289 - Complete 1504 - Complete 1144 - Out-of-bound array address 2081 - Resolved 1553 - nested module clarifications 2684 - variable part-selects 1861 - major modport enhancements 1523 - Resolved 3074 - Connectivity Enhancements 2124 - `default_nettype var-type directive Action Items Complete 06/06/11 Dave write proposal for 1523 Note: This was passed to Matt. A new AI regarding 1523 was assigned to Dave on 8/29 2011. 08/29/11 Matt check if mantis item filed regarding handling of ref variables in always_comb blocks. 08/29/11 Steven write a proposal for 2081 based on consensus reached during August 29, 2011 meeting. 08/29/11 Brad update proposal for 1251 with friendly amendment 08/29/11 Dave make another attempt at addressing 1523. 09/12/11 Dave update proposal for 1523 per friendly amendment. Outstanding 05/10/10 Matt create Master Issue for WG-approved SV-BC Top-25 07/19/10 Jonathan post some items for discussion related to 2114 to reflector. 08/02/10 Brad give SV-BC feedback on Mantis 2992 to Mehdi 08/02/10 Eric start reflector thread on Mantis 2310 08/16/20 All send Shalom feedback about prioritizing the issues raised in port declaration issue summary: http://www.eda.org/sv-bc/hm/10498.html 09/13/10 Jonathan show simple examples of virtual interfaces, sub-interfaces and base classes in modules to demonstrate different methods for connecting design and testbenches. 09/27/10 Review Shalom's list of interface issues and suggest issues to tackle now. 11/22/10 Brad to file Mantis item for upward passing of interfaces. 01/31/11 All check with users regarding viability of rule that virtual interface declarations require that the referenced interface be previously parsed. 02/14/11 Users consider proposed restrictions and use-cases for varargs and provide feedback. 03/14/11 Matt check back with Gord and Mark in April about feedback regarding interface issues. 03/14/11 All drill down on 3055 and identify issues that would be straightforward to clarify regarding constant expressions, type operations and what is a hierarchical name. 03/28/11 Check with Gord in early June 2011 regarding 2856 and his proposal to limit hierarchical references for parameters in module instantiations. 05/23/11 Dave to review with Gord the slides referenced by Brad regarding issue 2108. 06/20/11 Steven write a proposal for 3595 07/18/11 Francoise generalize other wording in 23.7 as suggested by Shalom and complete proposal for 3608 07/18/11 File new mantis item to clarify determination of true/false for If-statement (12.4), while, do-while, iff, conditional operator and potentially others for all data types. Does Mantis 1974 sufficiently capture the issue? 07/18/11 File new mantis item to request clarification of Short-circuiting of &&, ||, ->, ?: (11.3.5) 09/12/11 Matt check that all implemented Mantis items for Draft 2 have been reviewed.