RE: [sv-cc] Question on "rand" qualifer on struct elements

Dave, 

Even if you are correct, 13.3 says,

"Class variables can be declared random using the rand and randc
type-modifier keywords."

It does not say so explicitly, but a reasonable, even if incorrect,
interpretation of that sentence is the implication that 

"[Only] class variables can be declared ... using the rand and randc
type-modifier keywords."

Since there are no examples to show otherwise and all examples of rands
are in classes, this is an extremely reasonable interpretation.

If the LRM means otherwise, it needs to be explicit.

Regards,
Shalom
 

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Rich, Dave [mailto:Dave_Rich@mentor.com]
> Sent: Wednesday, December 06, 2006 5:52 PM
> To: Chuck Berking; Bresticker, Shalom; sv-cc@eda.org
> Subject: RE: [sv-cc] Question on "rand" qualifer on struct elements
> 
> Hi Chuck,
> 
> And this is not one of those cases because the LRM does not
specifically
> restrict it. It's in syntax box 4-4. and there's no rule or footnote
in
> the BNF that says you can't put it there if it's not in a clase, nor
> should there be.
> 
> The whole point of adding rand qualifiers to structs was so that the
> design and testbench could share typedefs. The rand qualifier just
> doesn't do anything when used outside of a class. Perhaps that needs
to
> be explicitly stated.
> 
> Dave
> 
> 
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Chuck Berking [mailto:berking@cadence.com]
> > Sent: Wednesday, December 06, 2006 7:15 AM
> > To: Bresticker, Shalom; Rich, Dave; sv-cc@eda.org
> > Subject: RE: [sv-cc] Question on "rand" qualifer on struct elements
> >
> > I agree completely.  There are many cases of "BNF-legal"
> > constructs which are specifically disallowed semantically,
> > which I believe should apply to this case.
> > -Chuck
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: owner-sv-cc@eda.org [mailto:owner-sv-cc@eda.org] On Behalf Of
> > Bresticker, Shalom
> > Sent: Wednesday, December 06, 2006 7:40 AM
> > To: Rich, Dave; sv-cc@eda.org
> > Subject: RE: [sv-cc] Question on "rand" qualifer on struct elements
> >
> > Dave,
> >
> > This is not at all clear.
> >
> > It is true that the BNF allows declaring any struct member as rand.
> >
> > However, many restrictions are expressed in the text of the LRM and
> not
> > in the BNF.
> >
> > The text of the LRM certainly seems to imply that rand declarations
> are
> > only allowed within classes.
> >
> > (One could say that typedefs are not really a question, because they
> > only define types, not actual variables.)
> >
> > I did not see anywhere in the LRM that the following is permitted:
> >
> > > typedef struct { rand int A;} A_t;
> > >
> > > A_t Av; // a regular struct;
> >
> > or that  a rand qualifier outside of a class is just ignored.
> > Did I miss some text?
> >
> > Unless there is some explicit text that I missed, I think a
> > clarification in the LRM is called for.
> >
> > It would seem strange if I could write outside a class
> >
> > struct ( rand int b; } cucu ;
> >
> > but not
> >
> > rand int b;
> >
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Shalom
> >
> >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: owner-sv-cc@server.eda.org
[mailto:owner-sv-cc@server.eda.org]
> > On
> > > Behalf Of Rich, Dave
> > > Sent: Wednesday, December 06, 2006 12:09 AM
> > > To: Bresticker, Shalom; Jim Vellenga; sv-cc@server.eda.org
> > > Subject: RE: [sv-cc] Question on "rand" qualifer on struct
elements
> > >
> > > No that's not correct. The BNF allows you to declare rand or randc
> on
> > a
> > > member of any struct or typedef of a struct. It's just that it's
> only
> > > treated as a random variable when declared rand as a member of a
> > class.
> > > That is, randomize() is a method of a class, not a method of a
> struct.
> > >
> > > typedef struct { rand int A;} A_t;
> > >
> > > A_t Av; // a regular struct;
> > >
> > > class C;
> > > rand A_t m_A;
> > > endclass
> > >
> > > C C_h = new; // a class with a random variable C_h.m_A.A
> > >
> > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > From: owner-sv-cc@server.eda.org
> [mailto:owner-sv-cc@server.eda.org]
> > > On
> > > > Behalf Of Bresticker, Shalom
> > > > Sent: Tuesday, December 05, 2006 8:52 AM
> > > > To: Jim Vellenga; sv-cc@server.eda.org
> > > > Subject: RE: [sv-cc] Question on "rand" qualifer on struct
> elements
> > > >
> > > > Yes. See 13.3.
> > > >
> > > > > Clarification:  Does a declaration with rand and randc
> > > > > qualifiers have to appear only inside a class declaration?
> > > >
> > > > Shalom